Beginning my 1987 Fisherman 20 Restoration
- Thread starter Myfathersson
- Start date
Myfathersson
Member
And here's the bilge drain sleeve all cleaned up on the inside.
Then my friendly UPS driver backed all the way up into my driveway to help me B.O.A.T.:
13.3 gallons of epoxy, more Cabosil, microbeads and gel colorant, and 40 yds of 17oz biax. I think that'll be the biggest single ticket order until I get to replacing the leaning post, adding a t-top and whatever I decide to to with the outboard.
Made up a mount to hold one of my high power laser pointers for laying out the stringers, then after the underwhelming storms powered through I power washed the whole thing. Could've gone a little lower on the drain hole but it's still much better than it was originally. Right now I'm just glad to have all the current grinding dust washed out for the next step. Cheers!
Then my friendly UPS driver backed all the way up into my driveway to help me B.O.A.T.:
13.3 gallons of epoxy, more Cabosil, microbeads and gel colorant, and 40 yds of 17oz biax. I think that'll be the biggest single ticket order until I get to replacing the leaning post, adding a t-top and whatever I decide to to with the outboard.
Made up a mount to hold one of my high power laser pointers for laying out the stringers, then after the underwhelming storms powered through I power washed the whole thing. Could've gone a little lower on the drain hole but it's still much better than it was originally. Right now I'm just glad to have all the current grinding dust washed out for the next step. Cheers!
I'm amazed at the progress you've made. Can't wait to see splashdown. I tip my hat to you sir!
Myfathersson
Member
Thank you! I'm really looking forward to the forecast break in the heat that's supposed to come tomorrow night, That will make throwing the bunny suit on to continue grinding a lot more bearable! As I marked out rough lines on the hull for stringers tonight I decided I didn't grind out far enough for the tabbing to come, and circled a few spots that I want to add a little glass to for reinforcing. Time to order up more grinding discs!
Myfathersson
Member
Agreed! Especially with plenty of supplies at the ready, very little extra material or labor would've been involved! But I guess then they wouldn't be able to sell you another one quite as soon...
Myfathersson
Member
love watching this stuff.
Thank you! I'm glad my contributions are being enjoyed!
Myfathersson
Member
Yesterday evening after work I took advantage of the drop in temp to climb in the suit and cut a bit. Got the sole partially stripped. As expected all of the plywood was rotten and delaminating.
And then today I stripped a little more before deciding the wind was too high to cut and grind without perturbing the neighbors. So once I power washed the cap down I pulled out the stringer stock and started on the stringers. I started with my laser pointer setup to get my heights:
Look close and you can make out the green dot back on the transom:
I set the height by a couple of strings through screw holes in the hull transposed from their matching holes in the cap where I measured precisely to the underside of the sole, and compared it with my records of dimensions before cutting the stringers out:
Took new measurements from the hull to line and transposed those new dimensions onto the stringer stock:
And traced the tail and utility cutout profiles from the original stringer shells:
Cut carefully and set it in place for a test fit:
Measured to make sure I had the right offset from the reference laser line, made a few adjustments and then repeated for the starboard side. Voila - two accurate fit stringers:
Then carried each one downstairs to the router table and put a 1/4" radius along the top edge to ease wrapping the 17oz biax around the profile:
Tomorrow I hope the weather (specifically the wind) cooperates to let me grind and wash down the hull so that I can proceed to bedding these two in place.
And then today I stripped a little more before deciding the wind was too high to cut and grind without perturbing the neighbors. So once I power washed the cap down I pulled out the stringer stock and started on the stringers. I started with my laser pointer setup to get my heights:
Look close and you can make out the green dot back on the transom:
I set the height by a couple of strings through screw holes in the hull transposed from their matching holes in the cap where I measured precisely to the underside of the sole, and compared it with my records of dimensions before cutting the stringers out:
Took new measurements from the hull to line and transposed those new dimensions onto the stringer stock:
And traced the tail and utility cutout profiles from the original stringer shells:
Cut carefully and set it in place for a test fit:
Measured to make sure I had the right offset from the reference laser line, made a few adjustments and then repeated for the starboard side. Voila - two accurate fit stringers:
Then carried each one downstairs to the router table and put a 1/4" radius along the top edge to ease wrapping the 17oz biax around the profile:
Tomorrow I hope the weather (specifically the wind) cooperates to let me grind and wash down the hull so that I can proceed to bedding these two in place.
Myfathersson
Member
Hoping this is a VERY productive Labor Day Weekend here. Here's what I was up to this week.
Took the stringers back down into the shop and worked on glassing the curved features on them. Glad I elected to do it in the comfort of the shop instead of in place. I was able to experiment and get a feel for how to conform to the curves. First one wasn't the prettiest and required lots of additional sanding but it is covered. Here's the second one where I started to get the hang of the right approach. Still room for improvement:
Yes - the shop needs for it to rain one day (or 7...) so I can straighten things up - it's even more disorganized than what you can see in these photos.
Then spent a night sanding them clean. With that out of the way I laid them in the hull, aligned the top edges and tacked them in place with peanut butter.
Came back the next night, lightly sanded the tacks and filleted them in 100%:
The boards clamped in place aren't the bulkheads, just spacers to align the tops and spacing and keep everything parallel:
That wrapped up the work week. This morning I took a 90 mile road trip and snagged a new (to me) tandem axle trailer:
Might have to make a small adjustment to the bow roller and winch mount but other than that it is sound and pulled like a feather on the drive home. Brakes on both axles and the bunks and carpet are in great shape for a salvage yard find. Just need to get 2 new tires.
Once I got back to Louisville I dove into sanding the fillets in preparation for glassing. I've been watching Boat Works Today videos on youtube and Andy recommended a handheld belt sander. He uses a Makita that retails for around $250. I couldn't (at the time) justify that pricetag so I snagged a smaller Wen off Amazon for about $35. I gotta say - this is an EXTREMELY versatile tool. Made easy work of sanding the fillets and tight areas between the stringers and strakes a relative breeze. If you're thinking about tackling a project like this I can't recommend one of these highly enough. The only draw back to this is the belt being so narrow makes it wear pretty quick. The dust collection isn't perfect but it's leaps and bounds better than using the grinder, and removes material almost as effectively. I just might pull the trigger on that Makita in the near future to get a little wider belt and larger radius on the head:
They're all sanded, vacuumed and washed down now:
Tomorrow morning I'll start cutting my sections of biax to prep for glassing. My goal is to get the starboard side glassed in tomorrow. If things go smoothly the port too, but I'm not holding my breath! I've slightly modified my layup plans. I had grand plans to do the whole length in a single piece but I think now that the time is nigh that plan was a wee bit overzealous for my experience level. So instead I'm doing 50x50 sections, overlapping the joints and staggering the layers.
Hope everyone else is enjoying their long weekend, hopefully out on the water, or like me - watching the long awaited triumphant return of college football - especially the University of Michigan! GO BLUE! HAIL HAIL!
Took the stringers back down into the shop and worked on glassing the curved features on them. Glad I elected to do it in the comfort of the shop instead of in place. I was able to experiment and get a feel for how to conform to the curves. First one wasn't the prettiest and required lots of additional sanding but it is covered. Here's the second one where I started to get the hang of the right approach. Still room for improvement:
Yes - the shop needs for it to rain one day (or 7...) so I can straighten things up - it's even more disorganized than what you can see in these photos.
Then spent a night sanding them clean. With that out of the way I laid them in the hull, aligned the top edges and tacked them in place with peanut butter.
Came back the next night, lightly sanded the tacks and filleted them in 100%:
The boards clamped in place aren't the bulkheads, just spacers to align the tops and spacing and keep everything parallel:
That wrapped up the work week. This morning I took a 90 mile road trip and snagged a new (to me) tandem axle trailer:
Might have to make a small adjustment to the bow roller and winch mount but other than that it is sound and pulled like a feather on the drive home. Brakes on both axles and the bunks and carpet are in great shape for a salvage yard find. Just need to get 2 new tires.
Once I got back to Louisville I dove into sanding the fillets in preparation for glassing. I've been watching Boat Works Today videos on youtube and Andy recommended a handheld belt sander. He uses a Makita that retails for around $250. I couldn't (at the time) justify that pricetag so I snagged a smaller Wen off Amazon for about $35. I gotta say - this is an EXTREMELY versatile tool. Made easy work of sanding the fillets and tight areas between the stringers and strakes a relative breeze. If you're thinking about tackling a project like this I can't recommend one of these highly enough. The only draw back to this is the belt being so narrow makes it wear pretty quick. The dust collection isn't perfect but it's leaps and bounds better than using the grinder, and removes material almost as effectively. I just might pull the trigger on that Makita in the near future to get a little wider belt and larger radius on the head:
They're all sanded, vacuumed and washed down now:
Tomorrow morning I'll start cutting my sections of biax to prep for glassing. My goal is to get the starboard side glassed in tomorrow. If things go smoothly the port too, but I'm not holding my breath! I've slightly modified my layup plans. I had grand plans to do the whole length in a single piece but I think now that the time is nigh that plan was a wee bit overzealous for my experience level. So instead I'm doing 50x50 sections, overlapping the joints and staggering the layers.
Hope everyone else is enjoying their long weekend, hopefully out on the water, or like me - watching the long awaited triumphant return of college football - especially the University of Michigan! GO BLUE! HAIL HAIL!
Myfathersson
Member
Suffice to say I am exhausted. Took a long time and a nudge from my brother in Ohio to decide to have a margarita and some dinner instead of just going to bed. 12 1/2 hours, 6 gallons of epoxy and 22 yards of glass later the stringers are laminated.
I made up a rod holder on the side of my gantry to hold the rolls of glass, and set up one of the sheets of plywood that's waiting to be used for the bulkheads as a cut table early this morning.
Felt like home ec class 30+ years ago all over again.
I started off trying to use rollers and smoked a couple batches of epoxy and trashed a roller frame so was in and out of the hull more than anticipated. The result...there might be a bit of grass laminated in the bilge... Threw down a layer of plastic which helped that, but unfortunately it liked to slide around on the excess epoxy draining out and to my shoes which have a nice healthy coat. A word to the wise - don't wear slip on shoes when epoxying - they might be convenient but when they get sticky they tend to slip off just as easily as they slip on!
But I got it done, including a layer of 1708 down the keel/bilge.
Left a little tag for whoever pulls this hull apart next:
That's a lot of epoxy...and based on the estimation from West Systems' page I only exceeded the estimate by a quarter gallon - and based on the smoked batches I tossed - I'd say it was spot on.
I know the layup isn't perfect - there are bubbles and I'm going to have to either drill and pump in a fill or grind and reglass a few spots on the fillets. I think the heat was too much today for this epoxy formulation - they laid down flat but then it really seemed like once they started to gel the whole lamination shrank. If I were to ever do this again (highly unlikely! LOL) I would laminate up each side of the stringer and then cap the top instead of trying to do a full wrap from tab to tab. Hindsight is 20/20. Should've followed the process so many others have used.
Tomorrow will be a well deserved day of relaxation. All I plan to do is pull the 2 worn tires off the new trailer and maneuver the trailer into the back yard so I can unhook it from the truck and then cut the grass. Happy Labor Day y'all!
Greg
I made up a rod holder on the side of my gantry to hold the rolls of glass, and set up one of the sheets of plywood that's waiting to be used for the bulkheads as a cut table early this morning.
Felt like home ec class 30+ years ago all over again.
I started off trying to use rollers and smoked a couple batches of epoxy and trashed a roller frame so was in and out of the hull more than anticipated. The result...there might be a bit of grass laminated in the bilge... Threw down a layer of plastic which helped that, but unfortunately it liked to slide around on the excess epoxy draining out and to my shoes which have a nice healthy coat. A word to the wise - don't wear slip on shoes when epoxying - they might be convenient but when they get sticky they tend to slip off just as easily as they slip on!
But I got it done, including a layer of 1708 down the keel/bilge.
Left a little tag for whoever pulls this hull apart next:
That's a lot of epoxy...and based on the estimation from West Systems' page I only exceeded the estimate by a quarter gallon - and based on the smoked batches I tossed - I'd say it was spot on.
I know the layup isn't perfect - there are bubbles and I'm going to have to either drill and pump in a fill or grind and reglass a few spots on the fillets. I think the heat was too much today for this epoxy formulation - they laid down flat but then it really seemed like once they started to gel the whole lamination shrank. If I were to ever do this again (highly unlikely! LOL) I would laminate up each side of the stringer and then cap the top instead of trying to do a full wrap from tab to tab. Hindsight is 20/20. Should've followed the process so many others have used.
Tomorrow will be a well deserved day of relaxation. All I plan to do is pull the 2 worn tires off the new trailer and maneuver the trailer into the back yard so I can unhook it from the truck and then cut the grass. Happy Labor Day y'all!
Greg
Slightly_Twisted
Junior Member
Wow you have made a ton of progress!
I can’t believe you got both glassed in.
What was your final layer up schedule?
Nice job!
Myfathersson
Member
Wow you have made a ton of progress!
I can’t believe you got both glassed in.
What was your final layer up schedule?
Nice job!
My body requires ibuprofen today! Thanks for the compliment. Final schedule is 2 layers of 17oz biax tabbed 10" onto the hull, with a layer of 1708 biax 38" wide down the keel which rolls up just to the top of the fillets. Original lamination was 0.0823" thick on the 24oz roving, my two layers yielded 0.0878" so it's at least as stout as what Wellcraft laid in there 32 years ago. The bulkheads down the keel will get the same treatment of 2 layers of 17oz, the side wings I only plan on a single layer.
Still need to order the fuel tank, figure out how I'm going to secure it, and decide if I'm replacing the foam or not. Might grab a dry chunk and figure out exactly what density it was to help calm my concerns that it might have had some structural value.
Slightly_Twisted
Junior Member
Nice yeah if your at the same thickness and you have 100% incapsulated the wood I would agree you are all set. Realistically the only reason they fail is water intrusion, if you really take your time a seal it it will last a life time.
For the tank I’m planning on no foam. The aluminum ones need air flow or they will pit and fail. I’m going with something close to this video. Over all a good install OTHER then I have not idea why he doesn’t seal the screws into the stringers!! To me that is a failure waiting for water intrusion.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8m0sVshBrXQ.
The poly tanks I’m no export on but I would think it would be no different. as along as it’s well supported on the sides and bottom.
For the tank I’m planning on no foam. The aluminum ones need air flow or they will pit and fail. I’m going with something close to this video. Over all a good install OTHER then I have not idea why he doesn’t seal the screws into the stringers!! To me that is a failure waiting for water intrusion.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8m0sVshBrXQ.
The poly tanks I’m no export on but I would think it would be no different. as along as it’s well supported on the sides and bottom.
SkunkBoat
God
About V20 foamed-in fuel tanks...
The fuel tank space was a sealed compartment. There was a pvc pipe to allow water to pass from fwd to aft bilge. The deck hatch was meant to be sealed watertight. Any water that got into that space stayed there.
You have to decide if you are going to make it a bilge space or seal it.
If you foam it you have to make it sealed with a pvc pipe. Foaming has the advantage of easily securing the tank without brackets. Of course, we know the problem of foam and aluminum tanks.
I foamed in a new aluminum tank because(at the time) I could not find a correct plastic tank with fittings in the same place and workable dimensions. I do believe there is a 55 gal Moeller tank out there that is correct.
I think a foamed plastic tank in a sealed compartment is the best solution.
oh, be careful if you find a plastic tank. New design tanks are not vented per EPA rules. You need a vented tank ...or you need to figure out what extra parts are required to use a non-vented tank.
Also, I worry that non-vented tanks expand and contract quite a bit so foaming may be a problem.
If you go with an open bilge space you will have standing bilge water under the tank and often touching the tank. You will have to hang the tank from your new stringers with bolts.(drill holes!!!)that's 360+ pounds
As for foam in the space outside the stringers I think it will deaden the sound and make it feel much more solid. Same with the foamed tank. Of course, it will be safer also.
Oh, plan on installing a forward bilge pump. You have the opportunity to plumb the hose out the side!
The fuel tank space was a sealed compartment. There was a pvc pipe to allow water to pass from fwd to aft bilge. The deck hatch was meant to be sealed watertight. Any water that got into that space stayed there.
You have to decide if you are going to make it a bilge space or seal it.
If you foam it you have to make it sealed with a pvc pipe. Foaming has the advantage of easily securing the tank without brackets. Of course, we know the problem of foam and aluminum tanks.
I foamed in a new aluminum tank because(at the time) I could not find a correct plastic tank with fittings in the same place and workable dimensions. I do believe there is a 55 gal Moeller tank out there that is correct.
I think a foamed plastic tank in a sealed compartment is the best solution.
oh, be careful if you find a plastic tank. New design tanks are not vented per EPA rules. You need a vented tank ...or you need to figure out what extra parts are required to use a non-vented tank.
Also, I worry that non-vented tanks expand and contract quite a bit so foaming may be a problem.
If you go with an open bilge space you will have standing bilge water under the tank and often touching the tank. You will have to hang the tank from your new stringers with bolts.(drill holes!!!)that's 360+ pounds
As for foam in the space outside the stringers I think it will deaden the sound and make it feel much more solid. Same with the foamed tank. Of course, it will be safer also.
Oh, plan on installing a forward bilge pump. You have the opportunity to plumb the hose out the side!
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SkunkBoat
God
don't like it. That tank is sitting in bilge water. That matting is holding water and whatever crap ends up in the bilge.
don't like it at all....
Myfathersson
Member
Just to clarify - I am NOT considering foaming the tank in. Hazard of mentioning two independent thoughts in one paragraph 
I am going to go with a poly tank - a Moeller FOLT5007 - https://www.oceanlinkinc.com/product/50-gallon-belly-shaped-tank-44-x-30-75-x-10-25-folt5007/ I have a gameplan of how I'm going to mount it, but waiting to detail the method until I have it in hand. I may wait to do the tank till spring. Not sure yet.
The foam I was referring to is the flotation foam down the side cavities either side of the stringers. If I'm gonna do it, best to do it while I've got it in 2 pieces. Just struggling with the decision either way.
I am going to go with a poly tank - a Moeller FOLT5007 - https://www.oceanlinkinc.com/product/50-gallon-belly-shaped-tank-44-x-30-75-x-10-25-folt5007/ I have a gameplan of how I'm going to mount it, but waiting to detail the method until I have it in hand. I may wait to do the tank till spring. Not sure yet.
The foam I was referring to is the flotation foam down the side cavities either side of the stringers. If I'm gonna do it, best to do it while I've got it in 2 pieces. Just struggling with the decision either way.
Slightly_Twisted
Junior Member
don't like it. That tank is sitting in bilge water. That matting is holding water and whatever crap ends up in the bilge.
don't like it at all....
Just rewatched the video. Skunk you are 100% correct. I totally missed he didn’t have a sealed compartment. Thanks for correction!
Myfathersson
Member
Took advantage of a light schedule and the lowest forecast temps for the next 10 days and jumped in the tyvek suit and ground down the sole today. It's now ready to be re-cored. (Any of the darker areas are just moist from the power wash post grinding).
And before I was ready to start grinding (didn't wanna wake up any late sleeping neighbors) I got all the wing templates made from lightweight cardboard. And I scuffed up the new glass in the hull to receive the tabbing for the wings and bulkheads.
Have a company picnic this weekend so I'll infill smaller pockets of time with cutting the wings and bulkheads out from the sheet and prepping the pieces of 1/2" for the sole. Getting closer to slapping the two halves back together!
(Prayers that I measured accurately and they actually fit together after all this would be GREATLY appreciated LOL)
And before I was ready to start grinding (didn't wanna wake up any late sleeping neighbors) I got all the wing templates made from lightweight cardboard. And I scuffed up the new glass in the hull to receive the tabbing for the wings and bulkheads.
Have a company picnic this weekend so I'll infill smaller pockets of time with cutting the wings and bulkheads out from the sheet and prepping the pieces of 1/2" for the sole. Getting closer to slapping the two halves back together!
(Prayers that I measured accurately and they actually fit together after all this would be GREATLY appreciated LOL)
Myfathersson
Member
Only had a part day today due to a picnic. So got out early this morning, turned on College Gameday and started cutting out the wings and bulkheads:
And voila:
Still need to finesse a few of the wings and make sure the tops are colinear across the stringers, and form the bottom edge of the bulkheads - decided it was a waste of cardboard to template those.
Then with the spare sheet of 3/4 ply out of the way I grabbed the 1/2 ply and started on the sole:
And then this evening after the picnic, I gulped a few ibuprofen thanks to the last roller coaster ride I took, and made up a kraft paper template of the foredeck. I'm debating using 3/4" for that for a couple reasons - #1 I have an extra sheet, but I look to be 1/2 sheet shy on 1/2", and #2 - I think it won't hurt with as unsupported as that area is. Going to sleep on it and decide tomorrow when I dig back in.
And voila:
Still need to finesse a few of the wings and make sure the tops are colinear across the stringers, and form the bottom edge of the bulkheads - decided it was a waste of cardboard to template those.
Then with the spare sheet of 3/4 ply out of the way I grabbed the 1/2 ply and started on the sole:
And then this evening after the picnic, I gulped a few ibuprofen thanks to the last roller coaster ride I took, and made up a kraft paper template of the foredeck. I'm debating using 3/4" for that for a couple reasons - #1 I have an extra sheet, but I look to be 1/2 sheet shy on 1/2", and #2 - I think it won't hurt with as unsupported as that area is. Going to sleep on it and decide tomorrow when I dig back in.
