Seized steering

P

peiserma

Member
I just took off the engine off my boat for its initial rehabilitation (it has not been run in many years). It's an '86 Johnson GT150. All parts of the steering system are seized, except for the cable. But since I had to cut the cable to get the engine off, that is now a moot point.

I do have a factory service manual, but it only covers the engine and not the steering components. I am not yet familiar with all the proper terms, so i will try to describe it as best as i can. I can get pictures up later if needed.

I first disconnected the steering arm from from the motor. The steering arm is actually connected directly to, and an integral part of, the steering cable. It is mounted horizontally through the tilt tube (where the engine tilts). The tilt tube has two grease fittings, and I did add grease. Still no movement. The steering cable nut comes off, but the arm still will not budge except by blunt-force trauma (aka big hammer). It appears like the arm is seized inside the tilt tube. Assuming I can get the arm out of the tilt tube with penetrating oil and some TLC, can the tilt tube be cleaned out and saved without removing it form the bracket? Are there new seals that need to be installed? Or should it be replaced?

Second seizure is the tiller arm. Not sure if that is the right term. It reminds me a little of a tiller on a sailboat, or the tiller on smaller outboards. It is mounted vertically to the midsection, and allows the motor to pivot port and starboard. The steering rod is normally connected to the tiller arm, but I have it disconnected. Even disconnected, I cannot turn the motor except with a BFH (Big *** Hammer). There's one grease fitting, but I can't get any grease in. I could try to put on a new grease fitting, but considering the state of the tilt tube this may be a waste of time.

I know the powerhead and midsection have to come off in order to get to the tiller arm. But before I do this, is it possible to clean out, reseal, and regrease this part? Or should it be replaced? Am I better off buying an entire "stern bracket assembly" that includes the steering components?

Most important, where do I look for parts? Used parts out of a boneyard are OK by me if new is hard to get or astronomically priced. I'm in Wilmington, NC.

Thanks for any advice.
 
Have you done a compression check on the engine? It would be easier to repower than rebuild a£ that if the engine has pör compression. If you have good compression i would say look for a new midsection. The steering arms are obsolete. I could never find one for my Johnson. As for steering, i say be on the safe side and buy a new system. It sounds like sitting has froze some components on that engine.

I tried to edit this earlier, but my phone wouldn't cooperate.

You may be able to save the steering shaft if its not rusted, and reuse it with new bearings,seals etc. Also Welcome to the site. Post pics, a picture is worth a thousand words.
 
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tilt tube is easy, just keep spraying it and hammer it home! If need be add a little hest, the word is LITTLE! Once you have ut out get a nice round wire brush, I used a shot gun cleaning one. keep spraying and ram the brush in and out till clean, now wrap a rag on it loaded with grease and you will be fine.

Now the other problem, thats going to be a bear! Same spray and start moving it little by little, becarful using thr hammer here as you put it thur the midsection it will be junk. You can also unscrew the grease fittings and add new ones to get some grease in there. If you have to replace the mid be sure as stated above that the motor is good, would suck to do all that work to find out its junk!!
 
I checked the compression last year when I bought it. I seem to recall around 95 for all cylinders. Might be a little low for a working motor, but hopefully OK for one that has been sitting for a while. What's a minimum compression number to fire an engine? I do not know and the service manual doesn't tell me. The crankshaft turned just fine when i put a wrench on it during the process of removing flywheel nut and attaching the lift ring. I plan on putting some cylinder lube (Lucas Oil brand) in the spark plug hole and letting it sit for a day or two to see where it would end up. Thoughts? I guess I'll go do that now and report results tomorrow

Here's a picture of the tiller from the front. You can see grease dripping out of the fittings on the tilt tube:
IMG_0017.jpg


And here is a picture of the tiller and the associated grease nipple from the side. The tilt and trim unit works, so I tilted it up for a better view:
IMG_0016.jpg
 
mj's right, if you take a punch or a piece of steel rod and pound the end of the steering cable out of the tube(you said you cut the cableoff at the nut) you can clean it up pretty easily. on the other issue, yo might try putting a wood block under the skeg and having someoneraise and lower the trailer tongue slightly to put a little pressure on it, if you get movement up and down, then shoot it with some pb blaster. heat is your friend, but when appling heat to aluminum, it can go bad real quick.
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good luck
 
The steering ARM that is showing in picture one I had one locked up like that one time and I put abolt thru it to hook a ratchet strap to the ARM and to a tree beside the boat I put light pressure on the rachet strap and had my dad trying to turning the motor the same direction at the lower unit also. And I did light taps on the ARM with a hammer in the direction of the pulling and it broke lose slowly. Take your time don't rush it. Light taps with steady pressure will go a long way. The powerhead should not have to come off to get to the transom bracket and all other tilt and pivot areas. Remove the lower unit and the 2 bolts that attach the "wishbone" end of the steering ARM to the mid section, remove the 2 side plates on the mid section down buy the lower unit they will expose 4 ss bolts that attach the lower part of the whole transom bracket to the mid section,then remove the 1 1/4 nut at bottom of pivot shaft to remove it from the transom bracket then clean and grease and reinstall. It sounds like a lot but if you are tuning her up you need to remove lower unit to replace water pump and seals. I just went thru this process to put my whole transom bracket back on my evinrude.
 
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ok, thanks so far!

I sprayed a little PB Blaster on the rod. While it was soaking, I took out the spark plugs and squirted some lube into the cylinders. Replaced spark plugs and turned the flywheel with a wrench a few revolutions. Removed plugs, added some more lube. Then I came back to the steering tube with a block of wood and a hammer. It came right out. Looks easy to clean up and re-grease.

I'll recheck compression tomorrow. Let's assume it is good and I decide to go ahead and pull the powerhead and midsection. Can I do something similar to the tiller tube (or whatever it is called) to clean and regrease? I'd hate to do all that work for something not worth saving.
 
Kracker Jack said:
The steering ARM that is showing in picture one I had one locked up like that one time and I put abolt thru it to hook a ratchet strap to the ARM
Click to expand...

I like it. I could get a ratchet to my stand and squirt a little PB Blaster on it every day. I could even weld a little bracket onto the stand (I welded it together out of 2 inch tube steel so that would be an easy modification). But the goal is to FIX it so it does not seize up again while I'm underway... I can remove the powerhead easily enough. Well, it might not be easy but I have an engine hoist so its not like I have to invest in any equipment. Just want to know if its worth doing. I guess the compression test will tell me that. Will post back in a day or two with real numbers instead of what I remember doing a year ago! [EDIT] If i only have to remove the lower unit as you say, which I was planning on doing anyway, for the reason you said, then maybe it won't be half-bad.
 
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Not sure what the stated compression is for your engine, but I have a 91' Johnson 200 and the compression is in the mid 90's...right where it's supposed to be. I really would't worry too much at this point about if your compression is too low ot too high. What you want to see is even compression within a few pounds over all cylinders. Anything more than 10 lbs difference can be an indication of possible trouble. Additionally, remember that a proper compression test is done on a warmed up engine... since you cannot do that don't be fearful if your numbers are a little low...

As far as the tilt tube goes, glad you got the cable out... squirt some WD40 down the tube, and like MJ said, run a 12 ga shotgun wirebrush down and back. I like to hook mine up to my electric drill so I get a spiral effect while I'm ramming the cleaning rod in and out. Makes short work of the cleaning process...

The "tiller" has been discussed at length already, I agree with what everyone else has said... lots of rust buster type fluids, (PB Blaster, Kroil, WD40), light taps, constant pressure. Move it back and forth and let the oils do their thing.. And a heat gun, not a torch will help out... (You have to be careful with a torch with all the oils around... don't want to start a fire or melt something
 
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