How's that "Hope and Change" working?

RWilson2526 said:
Damn, I think Larry is Destroyers evil twin.
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First time I've heard the word evil used to make a complement! :hi:

I dare say Obummer is the second worst leader this land has ever had..... The worst being King George III tho I'm not CERTAIN George was actually worse!

(not referring to bush)
 
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Spoogy, you are entitled to your beliefs. I've made that clear several times. But if you fire a gun at me, you can bet I'm going to return fire. Your comments were and are insulting to me, yet unlike you, I've kept quiet about being insulted. No more. If you think that I'm going to sit by while you insult me, lie to me and everyone else here with those posted "facts" and then allow you to think that you can do so with impunity, (simply because you seem to be able to use some fancy words here and there), perhaps you should think again.

The atmosphere in here is harsh. I admit it and I'll make no apologies for that. And if at times I seem to be a bully... well, so be it. As they say, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen". But nothing I post is knowingly false. Everything is well read before hand and then researched independently. You want to check my posts? Have at it. If I've made a mistake I'll welcome a correction.

I am a person of deep convictions. I'm a Patriot. I love my Country! And for the record, I'm not a Republican. I'm not a Democrat. I'm a highly conservative Independent. I'm a twice decorated Vietnam combat vet. And please, for the love of God, don't thank me for my service. No one did while I was in. It just sounds hollow now.

As before, I welcome you into these forums, and I look forward to anything you have to post with regards to boating, fishing, family matters, questions, in fact just about anything in the whole wide world.........Except your political views, because from where I stand, when someone starts a discussion, or a fight, and then runs away, they lose stature in my eyes. You have been trying to take the high road, aiming insult after insult, playing the wounded soul... "Oh poor me, you're ganging up on me, I'm insulted"....... And around here, it doesn't work. There are some highly intelligent people here that can see through smoke screens like that in an instant. And if you are insulted, well, "frankly Scarlet, I don't give a damn".

Cutting and pasting a bunch of useless "facts" is not a discussion. And I'll tell you right now that I will not believe you for a second if you try to tell me that you read and researched every one of those 245 supposed "facts" before you pasted them here. So, go ahead and use your fancy words and your bourgeoisie attitude. We of the proletariat are not impressed.
 
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Just a really quick reply. There is a caveat at the beginning of this thread, stating that " This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it!!" Perhaps, like those 245 "facts", you should have read that also.
 
I tried to read that whole list but I stopped when I got to this one.

6. Through an executive order, he created the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform. http://bit.ly/hwKhKa
Prevented a Bush Depression and Improved the Economy

If that list said that the president stopped a depression, I really would argue that whoever put that list together does not grasp how out economy and the Federal Reserve system really works. Actually restricting government spending would lessen the US's GDP and not improve it.

I am all for giving someone their fair shot when they win the office of the presidency but the guy in charge right now really has some bad things going on underneath him right now.

I am sure there is plenty that he did good for the country, I would say despite that, he has done more bad things.
 
"40. Issued an Executive Order on Presidential Records, which restored the 30-day time frame for former presidents to review records, and eliminated the right for the vice president or family members of former presidents to do the reviews. Provides the public with greater access to historic White House documents, and severely curtails the ability to use executive privilege to shield them." And yet, his personal records, grades, clients etc. are sealed FOR THE NEXT 50 YEARS.!!!!!!!!, Why ???????
 
Really? Why? Because he is a liar, a crook and a died in the wool socialist.
He feels nothing for the American People, actually holds them in disdain for not embracing the obviousness of his socialist ideals.
He holds the Constitution in disdain, feels it unduly restricts his plans for the utopian dream of his fathers.
He has secretly plotted against large segments of the American People to fundamentally transform America, starting with Fast and Furious, continuing with using the IRS to target Americans who disagree with him and a dozen other things that completely explain what kind of anti American trash he is.

The sorry thing for us as Americans, this country elected him twice. Shame on us.
We have a chance tomorrow to start fixing it, hopefully our liberal friends and we all have them God Bless their hearts have the courage and foresight to help
 
Maybe, just maybe there is hope tonight that the American People can see the forest for the trees.
The Senate is now in the hands of people who will actually debate issues and vote on Bill's presented to them by the Peoples House.
Harry Reid go sit down with the rest of the scum.
 
Yesterday, we, the American public, sent a clear message to both parties that we do not like the president's policy's, that we do not want America to be "fundamentally changed". Over the past 6 years, the house has sent over 800 bills to the Senate. All sat in limbo because Harry Reid, acting on the presidents orders, would not let any of them come up for a vote. Now admittedly, not every bill was good, and not every bill would have passed. But the point is that none of them were even debated... none of them ever came to the floor for a vote. Hopefully with the Senate and the Congress now firmly in the hands of the Republicans that logjam will finally be cleared and Washington will actually start doing what they are getting paid to do. Do not expect every bill to be signed by the president. He still has the very powerful veto pen in his pocket. But at least if he veto's everything that comes before him the American public will see who the real party of "no" is. Let us hope and pray that he doesn't just reject everything that comes before him since we have some very real problems with this country and we need both parties working together to fix them.

Yes, I personally am elated with the election results, but I am also cognoscente of the fact that now we have an obligation and a sacred duty to try to work together and resolve some of the problems facing us. ISIS, Ebloa, Keystone, Immigration, & Minimum wage are just a few of them. The time for politics is over. The real work begins now!
 
an update on that hope and change bs. We got our revised summary for health insurance for next year, it will be $1142 per month for me and my two daughters at $5000 deductible/out of pocket per year.:nut: Before O care, it was $546 per month with a $1000 deductible/out of pocket. I want to personally thank all the asshats that voted for this crap, you can show your appreciation by making a monthly payment to my personal account to offset my increased premiums. I take cash check and paypal. :butt:Before any one suggest it, we make too much money to get the subsidies and because of my daughters health history I'm not taking any chance by shopping another company. Changes are coming again for the health care industry and its not going to get any better. I blame all who voted for this crap.
 
Spare that sucks man.

I'm wondering what I'm gonna do next time mine goes up. Maxed out at the most I'm willing to afford now. My flood insurance about doubled this year too. Never had a claim. The policy is administrated by my old insurance company. My new guy told me NOT to switch it over to him because he's had others go up 4-5 times what they were paying! If I didn't have family that counted on me for certain things I'd seriously go John Galt. Check out of society and refuse to play the game. Find an old trawler to live on and not own anything.
 
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the worse part is, if my wife were on this policy, it would be an additional $759 per month. Luckily she is on her companies policy(its gotten pretty crappy as well). My health insurance is by far the most expensive thing we have. I have a reasonable house payment(far less than the insurance), our vehicles are paid for(newest one is an 02 with 165k miles) We have one credit card with less than a $500 balance and thats it. I just paid out $1400 for dental work as well. Right now I'm considering closing my business if I can get on with a plant maintenance company that services Google and Boeing. I've had to go back to school to get the classes I need to get hired on. The money will be less but they offer family insurance policies that will offset the income difference(I'll still keep Kendall on her same policy). We are witnessing the demise of the middle class and small business.
 
I feel your pain. We don't pay nowhere near what you are, but it is sad that health insurance is also our biggest out of pocket expense, and has just about put us in the poor house. My wife is a teacher, and it used to be you became a teacher for the benefits, well not no more. She is now paying $60 a month(I know not much, but her pay is very low because she is supposed to get benefits to offset it and bring it up to what other public teachers make), we pay $380 a month for mine through the exchange(Hated doing it, but had to so we could afford groceries), and our son is through the state. Before ocare we could all have PREMIUM insurance through her work that covered EVERYTHING for under $250 a month, now there crappy coverage(that meets ocare guidelines) is $800 a month for a family. We spend more on insurance than anything else in this world if you really think about it. Health, dental, vision, life, burial, auto, gap, homeowners, finance, mortgage, and so on. It is scary to think of what some people really pay out in insurance every month. We don't have that many coverages, and we spend close to half of our income on insurance alone every year. We don't make much, but we barely skim by. You shouldn't have to make a $100K a year to live a decent life, but anymore it looks that way.

I remember as a kid our family didn't make but about $40K a year, and we lived a very nice life, and weren't wanting for much. But today $40K a year is barely living above poverty if you live by the rules.
 
So, Spoogy, years ago you posted this about Obama:

1. Within his first week, he signed an Executive Order ordering an audit of government contracts, and combating waste and abuse.

Now, years past our national debt has grown, under Obama's watch, from 8 Trillion, to 18 Trillion dollars, What about that audit about waste and abuse ?, Did he read the report ?
I guess not.....
 
The game and it's nuances can bite me.

Just got a letter from the health insurance company, my grandfathered plan is no longer available.

I thought I was gonna be able to keep my plan?

Thats what those lying bastards said wasn't it?

I remember some lying bastard saying it over and over on the news/tv/mind control box so it must be fuking true right?

They will let me keep it till the end of the year but will be charging me an additional 90 bucks a month which is still 100 bucks cheaper than any plan I've been able to find elsewhere. I've been pretty much maxed out at what they were charging last year. I'm tired of being a cash cow for these sons of *****es. I've got a $20,000 deductible $10,000 for me, $10,000 for my wife, one can't go towards another I find out, before they have to chip in anything but a doctor check up that I have to pay 50 towards. Don't know the path from here, but do know I'm done. There's more to life than being a slave and paying what could be a mortgage payment to these bastards so other low lifes can suck the whole thing dry. Sitting on their fat asses driving a car or truck 20+ years newer than mine. Done.
 
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Yep, obamas been so good I've had to get on disability just for medicare because we couldnt afford health insurance. You guys can spin it anyway you want, but you can't blame Bush forever. At some point, o is going to have to own this mess. All he's done is throw money at the fire to keep it burning, but eventually we'll run out of money to throw at it, and when it goes out, we'll have a real mess.
 
Goodness knows there is plenty of blame to go around amongst both Democrats and Republicans. Neither side wants to sincerely address the debt. Republicans don't have the will, because it would likely cost them votes. Some Democrats may have that mindset, but a part of me is beginning to believe that many of them want us to go down the road to financial disaster, because ultimately it will give them more power over us. Conspiracy theory? It's pretty commonly known in the insurance business that Obamacare was designed to fail, and be the catalyst for universal health care. Sorry, spoggy, but I'm not buying that they thought they could correct its "issues" afterward in Congress. It was pushed through without adequate review in completely partisan fashion ("we have to pass it to find out what's in it"), and took the SCOTUS' legislating from the bench for it to not be overturned. It is a cluster **** of epic proportions, and as is more often than not the case, those that wrote and passed it are not subject to it. And don't get me started on Ezra Klein.

I hope not to spend too much time politic-ing here, as this is one of the few forums I visit where it doesn't come up much. But, when in Rome...
 
spoggy said:
So, I've really tried to stay out of this particular forum, because I know I'm in the minority. I hear and understand that everyone is pissed at the current situation, and I have two more points to make.

First, our government consists of 3 branches, the legislative, judicial and executive. Any ONE branch can act as a check to the other two. Obama cannot act in a vacuum. If congress doesn't like his wielding of the executive pen, they can craft law to defeat his efforts. Please bear this in mind. Congress can stop Obama if they choose to.

Second, and many of you wont like this, so I'll apologize first. My wife works in government relations for one of the top five health care systems in the United States. She drafted portions of the ACA with respect to reimbursement. People in Washington knew there would be issues with the ACA when it was passed, but the intent was to modify it by law through congress. The republicans gained control, and in an effort to repeal the ACA and get support for doing so from the public, have blocked every bill that would improve the ACA and relieve some of the financial burden of those insured. Let me make this clear, the republicans are blocking legislation that would make the ACA easier and cheaper to use so they can get enough support to repeal it. In the meantime, it's you folks that suffer for the stiff necks in Washington.
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Oh please. DO NOT insult our intelligence with dribble and spin like this. Fact. Obamacare was passed in the dead of night by the DEMOCRATS under the guidance of Pelossi and Reid.
Fact. The cost of health insurance for most people just about DOUBLED as soon as it passed.
Fact. That BS about the Republicans blocking every bill is just pure bull. BOTH parties have blocked bills from the other side. The Democrats (who passed this TAX in the first place) are just as guilty as the Republicans, if not more so since they passed this piece of $HIT bill on the American public in the first place!

The government has NO BUSINESS being in health care in the first place! This whole ACA was nothing more than an (unfortunately successful) attempt on the part of the federal government to be able to exert more power over us. (It now controls our money, our food and our medical. Don't tell me that we are free... we're on the path to a dictatorship the likes of which we've never seen. As soon as they take away our guns [One of Hillarys objectives] we're just meat ready to be cut up on the Progressives carving table) And the ONLY way they were able to get this POS bill passed was for the SCOTUS to declare it a TAX (even though the Dems had lied and declared time and time again that it wasn't) Although I cannot prove it, I still think that someone got to that traitor Roberts, who changed his opinion and invented out of whole cloth a new definition of taxation that contravenes long-standing precedent. He added hundreds of billions of dollars to the federal deficit, by way of his Medicaid ruling. And he forever tarnished his legacy as a Justice, and his promise to the nation that "he would serve as an umpire, and remember that it's my job to call balls and strikes, and not to pitch or bat".
But that's just my opinion, and as I said, I cannot prove it. But what I DO KNOW is that since this bill was passed people have had their MANDATED health insurance become an Albatross around their necks, putting them in financial ruin, forcing them to work 2 and 3 jobs just to pay for it. This is NOT what our government is supposed to do to it's citizens. and if anyone is so blind that they cannot see who is directly responsible for this in the first place, ... well, frankly I feel sorry for them because they cannot see past the smoke screen of spin that is in front of them. And now they are trying to elect a thoroughly corrupt politician that belongs in jail, is a liar, very likely a thief and perhaps a murderer. And this is the best they could come up with? That tells you a lot about their party. But I digress.. Obamacare has been a disaster that has cost American taxpayers trillions of dollars in unnecessary costs. Blaming it on the Republicans is just another spin job. It was Democrats that passed it. Period. Anything more than that is just smoke and mirrors spin.
 
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